Comments on: An Open Letter to Geeky Guys (Non-geeks may learn something, too): http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136 Because we care about stuff Wed, 10 Mar 2010 18:49:51 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Seshat http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-172442 Seshat Fri, 28 Aug 2009 01:33:13 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-172442 One of the things that's truly sad is that nearly thirty years later, this strip is still current and appropriate. http://www.airshipentertainment.com/growfcomic.php?date=20070304 Le sigh. One of the things that’s truly sad is that nearly thirty years later, this strip is still current and appropriate.

http://www.airshipentertainment.com/growfcomic.php?date=20070304

Le sigh.

]]> By: tekanji http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-171757 tekanji Sat, 22 Nov 2008 16:23:15 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-171757 <b>Cindy:</b> I was going to give your response a real answer, but given that I just deleted another comment from you that was a long-winded way of you saying, "Nyah-nyah, I'm a troll who is entitled to be a big asshole to you, oh yeah and I'm too good to respect the rules of your blog," I'm not exactly feeling charitable towards you at the moment. You may think that you're a special fucking snowflake because you aren't like <i>those</i> women, but the truth is that you are a woman, just like me and all the other female-identified people out there. The problem with being "one of the guys" is that when it comes down to it <b>you aren't a guy</b> and hanging out with people who share the same low opinion of women as you do only means that they utlimately think about <b>you</b> in the same way. So enjoy your exceptionalism while it lasts; I don't envy you. When reality hits you, it's going to hit pretty fucking hard. Cindy: I was going to give your response a real answer, but given that I just deleted another comment from you that was a long-winded way of you saying, “Nyah-nyah, I’m a troll who is entitled to be a big asshole to you, oh yeah and I’m too good to respect the rules of your blog,” I’m not exactly feeling charitable towards you at the moment. You may think that you’re a special fucking snowflake because you aren’t like those women, but the truth is that you are a woman, just like me and all the other female-identified people out there. The problem with being “one of the guys” is that when it comes down to it you aren’t a guy and hanging out with people who share the same low opinion of women as you do only means that they utlimately think about you in the same way. So enjoy your exceptionalism while it lasts; I don’t envy you. When reality hits you, it’s going to hit pretty fucking hard.

]]> By: Cindy http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-171746 Cindy Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:27:05 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-171746 Well, I don't classify myself as a "geek girl" (I'm not smart enough), but I've played a few MUD's. My main isssues were with the other female players, NOT the guys. I tell you, some women really shoot themselves in the foot. While engaged in a confrontation with one particularly rotten female, she blurted out "I'm prettier than you!". Now, nevermind the fact that this had absolutely NOTHING to do with gameplay... but this moron had never even laid eyes on me! In contrast, one of my allies in the game (a male) said something that really threw me backwards. I was planning a sneak attack on the above-mentioned wench, but got scared and was trying to chicken out. Well, the male friend got very upset and scolded me for trying to "whimp out". I was shocked that he thought that highly of me and held me to what is usually considered male standards of bravery. Far too often, female weakness is permitted (if not encouraged) in our society. I thought it was great that this guy had the same expectations of me that he would have of another male player. It was nice to be treated as an equal, for once. Final thoughts: Many times, women are their own worst enemies. I've always gotten along much better with men because they are, obviously, not obsessed with competing against me for male attention. Also, in my experiances, men do not gossip about me behind my back, like other women do. In my high school years, it was the girls who treated me like crap (a sort of Carrie situation. lol), but most of the guys were very nice to me. So, I wont be jumping on the feminist bandwagon any time soon. Well, I don’t classify myself as a “geek girl” (I’m not smart enough), but I’ve played a few MUD’s.

My main isssues were with the other female players, NOT the guys. I tell you, some women really shoot themselves in the foot. While engaged in a confrontation with one particularly rotten female, she blurted out “I’m prettier than you!”. Now, nevermind the fact that this had absolutely NOTHING to do with gameplay… but this moron had never even laid eyes on me!

In contrast, one of my allies in the game (a male) said something that really threw me backwards. I was planning a sneak attack on the above-mentioned wench, but got scared and was trying to chicken out. Well, the male friend got very upset and scolded me for trying to “whimp out”. I was shocked that he thought that highly of me and held me to what is usually considered male standards of bravery. Far too often, female weakness is permitted (if not encouraged) in our society. I thought it was great that this guy had the same expectations of me that he would have of another male player. It was nice to be treated as an equal, for once.

Final thoughts: Many times, women are their own worst enemies. I’ve always gotten along much better with men because they are, obviously, not obsessed with competing against me for male attention. Also, in my experiances, men do not gossip about me behind my back, like other women do. In my high school years, it was the girls who treated me like crap (a sort of Carrie situation. lol), but most of the guys were very nice to me. So, I wont be jumping on the feminist bandwagon any time soon.

]]> By: Happy Geeky Girl http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-170925 Happy Geeky Girl Fri, 09 May 2008 21:36:44 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-170925 Great post! Took me long enough to find it. Comebacks are the best thing for your arsenal, geeky ladies. I too am a geek girl. I'm taken but I like to keep the comebacks... except its so hard to use the good ones at conferences :S Any guy dumb enough to think I exist for him to date isn't smart enough for me to consider mixing genes with. Great post! Took me long enough to find it.
Comebacks are the best thing for your arsenal, geeky ladies. I too am a geek girl. I’m taken but I like to keep the comebacks… except its so hard to use the good ones at conferences :S

Any guy dumb enough to think I exist for him to date isn’t smart enough for me to consider mixing genes with.

]]> By: Official Shrub.com Blog » Blog Archive » The Realism Defense http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-147839 Official Shrub.com Blog » Blog Archive » The Realism Defense Sun, 09 Dec 2007 01:46:25 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-147839 [...] there are other uncomfortable aspects to the game which are not so easily ignored, such as the geek-girl fetish of the Brothel of Cartesian Dualism Slating Intellectual Lusts, or how every girl’s crazy for [...] [...] there are other uncomfortable aspects to the game which are not so easily ignored, such as the geek-girl fetish of the Brothel of Cartesian Dualism Slating Intellectual Lusts, or how every girl’s crazy for [...]

]]> By: Danielle http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-52396 Danielle Fri, 30 Mar 2007 05:32:19 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-52396 I have acquaintances who introduce me as smart and then want to "say something smart". So I take out my little tambourine and I dance like a monkey? Right. Good points made here. We are not monkeys to dance for the pleasure of others. I have acquaintances who introduce me as smart and then want to “say something smart”. So I take out my little tambourine and I dance like a monkey? Right. Good points made here. We are not monkeys to dance for the pleasure of others.

]]> By: BiSHoP http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-12780 BiSHoP Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:18:40 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-12780 This certainly leaves women as Other, if you consider the four male options presented (I will concede that the author probably has more in mind than just four) as Self. However, I don’t think it’s a restricted Other, it’s an Other the author is using because it is clearer than Self: it does not have the filters and stupidity attached to “alpha male” or “insecure wisecracker” which cause the character to “never come out the way [he] wants”. I’m not trying to suggest that playing a male character is as fraught with difficulty as our massively oppressed male lives This certainly leaves women as Other, if you consider the four male options presented (I will concede that the author probably has more in mind than just four) as Self. However, I don’t think it’s a restricted Other, it’s an Other the author is using because it is clearer than Self: it does not have the filters and stupidity attached to “alpha male” or “insecure wisecracker” which cause the character to “never come out the way [he] wants”. I’m not trying to suggest that playing a male character is as fraught with difficulty as our massively oppressed male lives

]]> By: Nathanael Nerode http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-1903 Nathanael Nerode Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:55:19 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-1903 Think about this. I'm male and I nearly *always* role-play female characters (in games where I have a choice). I'm not comfortable role-playing male characters; perhaps because of the macho stereotyping which gets pushed on them. (I get enough of that in my daily life.) I don't know why really, but I just gravitate towards female characters. In D&D too. I've met a few other people like me. One thing about us is that we are usually very serious about our characters. If you meet me in an MMORPG, you will probably assume I am female. (And, yes, fending off the suggestive comments does get really annoying.) You'll never know unless you ask. In contrast, there are a lot of female characters which are very clearly being played by males, who usually don't bother to hide it or to get into character very much, and who reveal their ignorance of what it's like to be female to a degree even *I*, a male who believes that there are few if any essential differences between men and women, can spot. I know of at least one case where a serious male role-player playing a female character really shocked and offended a male player, because their characters had been having a romance, and when he found out that her player was male, I guess homophobia kicked in.... Just random thoughts. Think about this. I’m male and I nearly *always* role-play female characters (in games where I have a choice). I’m not comfortable role-playing male characters; perhaps because of the macho stereotyping which gets pushed on them. (I get enough of that in my daily life.) I don’t know why really, but I just gravitate towards female characters. In D&D too.

I’ve met a few other people like me. One thing about us is that we are usually very serious about our characters. If you meet me in an MMORPG, you will probably assume
I am female. (And, yes, fending off the suggestive comments does get really annoying.) You’ll never know unless you ask. In contrast, there are a lot of female characters which are very clearly being played by males, who usually don’t bother to hide it or to get into character very much, and who reveal their ignorance of what it’s like to be female to a degree even *I*, a male who believes that there are few if any essential differences between men and women, can spot.

I know of at least one case where a serious male role-player playing a female character really shocked and offended a male player, because their characters had been having a romance, and when he found out that her player was male, I guess homophobia kicked in….

Just random thoughts.

]]> By: Liz http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-1839 Liz Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:00:04 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-1839 I want to say something that isn't strictly related to the post, but has been brought up in the comments: there are lots of reasons that people, including geeks male and female, go to college sporting events. I don't care for football, which is the sport that's been specifically mentioned in some other comments, but I (a serious gamer geek, and also a girl) go to baseball games anytime I get the chance, watch them on TV, briefly participated in a fantasy baseball league until I got fed up with being offered really stupid trades and obsessing over whether part of the reason people tried to get away with that was because I listed myself with a female name -- in short, I am a fan of a sport. So are a bunch of my geek friends. I don't <i>think</i> that I, or the majority of my geek friends, am there because of a fetishization of the players or of the sport itself, although it's always possible that I'm not aware of my own fetishization. I'm there because it's fun to watch, and it's fun to yell unproductive but brilliant managerial decisions at the TV. I have friends who are there because they really, really like the statistical and strategic aspect of the game (those are the friends who tend to be super-active in fantasy leagues, and also who love to play chess and Risk and strategy-oriented games). I have friends who are there because they like taking a few hours to sit around with friends and chat and goof off and have some snacks and drinks, and they don't especially care what's going on in the background, whether it's a baseball game or whatever else. This isn't a huge deal; it's just that it's another arena, like gaming, where my interest is constantly called into question because of my gender, and that's annoying, and I imagine it's just as annoying for guys to hear that the only reason they're there is that they've bought into a cultural fetishization of physically skilled men as it is for me to hear that the only reason I'm there is that boys in tight pants are cute. I want to say something that isn’t strictly related to the post, but has been brought up in the comments: there are lots of reasons that people, including geeks male and female, go to college sporting events. I don’t care for football, which is the sport that’s been specifically mentioned in some other comments, but I (a serious gamer geek, and also a girl) go to baseball games anytime I get the chance, watch them on TV, briefly participated in a fantasy baseball league until I got fed up with being offered really stupid trades and obsessing over whether part of the reason people tried to get away with that was because I listed myself with a female name — in short, I am a fan of a sport. So are a bunch of my geek friends. I don’t think that I, or the majority of my geek friends, am there because of a fetishization of the players or of the sport itself, although it’s always possible that I’m not aware of my own fetishization. I’m there because it’s fun to watch, and it’s fun to yell unproductive but brilliant managerial decisions at the TV. I have friends who are there because they really, really like the statistical and strategic aspect of the game (those are the friends who tend to be super-active in fantasy leagues, and also who love to play chess and Risk and strategy-oriented games). I have friends who are there because they like taking a few hours to sit around with friends and chat and goof off and have some snacks and drinks, and they don’t especially care what’s going on in the background, whether it’s a baseball game or whatever else. This isn’t a huge deal; it’s just that it’s another arena, like gaming, where my interest is constantly called into question because of my gender, and that’s annoying, and I imagine it’s just as annoying for guys to hear that the only reason they’re there is that they’ve bought into a cultural fetishization of physically skilled men as it is for me to hear that the only reason I’m there is that boys in tight pants are cute.

]]> By: Alas, a blog » Blog Archive » Race and Video Game Avatars http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136/comment-page-1#comment-1827 Alas, a blog » Blog Archive » Race and Video Game Avatars Sun, 20 Aug 2006 05:45:05 +0000 http://blog.shrub.com/archives/tekanji/2006-02-04_136#comment-1827 [...] Video games often give us a way to explore different aspects of ourselves. When we’re given a choice over character development, oftentimes we will choose avatars that are in some way different from our “mundane” personalities. I have, in the past, criticized men who play as women, but I think that the important deciding factor in whether or not having a woman avatar is sexist lies in how the female persona is treated, not in the gender of the player. I think it’s important to ask questions such as: Has she been picked because she’s a hot piece of ass? Exotic in a way that a male couldn’t be to the player? Roleplaying wise, has she been picked to play The Girl, or is she a well rounded character who happens to be female? [...] [...] Video games often give us a way to explore different aspects of ourselves. When we’re given a choice over character development, oftentimes we will choose avatars that are in some way different from our “mundane” personalities. I have, in the past, criticized men who play as women, but I think that the important deciding factor in whether or not having a woman avatar is sexist lies in how the female persona is treated, not in the gender of the player. I think it’s important to ask questions such as: Has she been picked because she’s a hot piece of ass? Exotic in a way that a male couldn’t be to the player? Roleplaying wise, has she been picked to play The Girl, or is she a well rounded character who happens to be female? [...]

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