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	<title>Comments on: Pimp Your/My Oppression</title>
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	<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293</link>
	<description>Because we care about stuff</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:01:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: real men are not &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Linkfest (Lite)</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-2971</link>
		<dc:creator>real men are not &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Linkfest (Lite)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Oct 2006 04:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-2971</guid>
		<description>[...] And since Amazon has those handy &#8220;If you&#8217;re interested in&#8230;&#8221; links, I immediately saw this little number next to the book above: How To Become An Alpha Male: Attract Women And Be Successful At Seduction. One of the rare times that I actually sat down to write a long, thought-out, edited post..I talked about this sort of literature. Shameless plug here. [#] [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] And since Amazon has those handy &#8220;If you&#8217;re interested in&#8230;&#8221; links, I immediately saw this little number next to the book above: How To Become An Alpha Male: Attract Women And Be Successful At Seduction. One of the rare times that I actually sat down to write a long, thought-out, edited post..I talked about this sort of literature. Shameless plug here. [#] [...]</p>
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		<title>By: J.J.</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1467</link>
		<dc:creator>J.J.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Jul 2006 00:00:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1467</guid>
		<description>This blog is superb, congrats! But- I read â€œWhat really Works with Womenâ€, after hearing Katalin Conway presenting. She blew me away: stunning looks, super smart, successfully married but constantly hit on, incredibly powerful insights! She distinguishes machos, without lasting success, and master players, who get any women, even the ONE they really want.
 
She taught me to see dating/relationships NOT as war between sexes, but a fun Game of two equal but different partners. And the better you know the rules (and the cheats!), the better you play! 
Never found any greater guide/cheat book to women than â€œWhat really Worksâ€¦.!â€  J.J.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This blog is superb, congrats! But- I read â€œWhat really Works with Womenâ€, after hearing Katalin Conway presenting. She blew me away: stunning looks, super smart, successfully married but constantly hit on, incredibly powerful insights! She distinguishes machos, without lasting success, and master players, who get any women, even the ONE they really want.</p>
<p>She taught me to see dating/relationships NOT as war between sexes, but a fun Game of two equal but different partners. And the better you know the rules (and the cheats!), the better you play!<br />
Never found any greater guide/cheat book to women than â€œWhat really Worksâ€¦.!â€  J.J.</p>
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		<title>By: duck</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1315</link>
		<dc:creator>duck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jun 2006 07:31:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1315</guid>
		<description>I agree 100%, and I also believe that on a broader level, this "commodity" programming is not entirely gender-specific.  We live in a society that has become a curious combination of celebrity-worship and populism.  We are fascinated by the behavior of the rich and famous, but we also believe that we are equally entitled to what they have.  This is why people with $30,000 salaries are going deeply into debt to lease BMWs.  It's why people with no basic health insurance will plunk down a few thousand dollars for cosmetic surgery.  After all, movie stars and aging rockers date Victoria's Secret models, so why should the average guy settle for less?  

But this attitude is not confined to men.  As a girlfriend of mine said the other day, "When you're not thin and cute it's so hard to find someone who 'clicks' with you."  What she meant was, "When you don't look like Angelina Jolie it's hard to get Brad Pitt's attention."  Beautiful people, it seems, are in shorter supply than BMWs, and unfortunately they have superficial standards of their own.  Enter the commodity fantasy.  Maybe there's some magic way to "trick" the system.  Some pickup line or cool automobile or cellulite cream that will enable you to attract a bigger "hottie" than you really deserve.  This is the notion that the entire advertising industry is built on.  

Ironically, at the end of the day women may actually have it slightly easier.  Rather than telling us how to exploit the simplistic minds of beautiful men, our "commodity" messages tell us what's wrong with ourselves.  We're barraged with the notion that men may not find us attractive if we have wrinkles or wide bottoms, and that we're on the downhill side of life after age 30.  While those messages are certainly degrading and unfair, in the end they may actually force us to become a bit more focused and realistic in our expectations.  

Men, on the other hand, receive the exact opposite message.  The world is full of con artists peddling the notion that any man can have his choice of the world's most perfect women, as long as he has the right "abracadabra."  So why settle?  "Live it up," say the hucksters, "sow your oats.  Once you perfect your 'line,' you'll have a whole stable of flawless women. You have all the time in the world.  Look at Jack Nicholson and Mick Jagger and Hugh Hefner."  

The result is a large pool of lonely "average" people (of both sexes) who find themselves incapable of being physically attracted to other "average" people.  I'm not sure I agree that the majority of them see the opposite sex as simply a commodity.  The media may present it in that light, but that's largely because the media is in the business of selling commodities.  I think most of us want to find a deep and lasting relationship.... with someone who is ridiculously gorgeous.  This is because "ridiculously gorgeous" has become our society's baseline standard for physical attractiveness.  

I don't presume to pontificate about superficiality, because I myself have been guilty of the same mentality.  But I do think it's critical to ask how we, on a personal level, can step back from this self-destructive approach to sexuality, in the face of so many societal messages that reinforce the contrary.  The alternative is a world where the fast majority of us will find it imposssible to start and maintain healthy and satisfying relationships.  

Ideas?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree 100%, and I also believe that on a broader level, this &#8220;commodity&#8221; programming is not entirely gender-specific.  We live in a society that has become a curious combination of celebrity-worship and populism.  We are fascinated by the behavior of the rich and famous, but we also believe that we are equally entitled to what they have.  This is why people with $30,000 salaries are going deeply into debt to lease BMWs.  It&#8217;s why people with no basic health insurance will plunk down a few thousand dollars for cosmetic surgery.  After all, movie stars and aging rockers date Victoria&#8217;s Secret models, so why should the average guy settle for less?  </p>
<p>But this attitude is not confined to men.  As a girlfriend of mine said the other day, &#8220;When you&#8217;re not thin and cute it&#8217;s so hard to find someone who &#8216;clicks&#8217; with you.&#8221;  What she meant was, &#8220;When you don&#8217;t look like Angelina Jolie it&#8217;s hard to get Brad Pitt&#8217;s attention.&#8221;  Beautiful people, it seems, are in shorter supply than BMWs, and unfortunately they have superficial standards of their own.  Enter the commodity fantasy.  Maybe there&#8217;s some magic way to &#8220;trick&#8221; the system.  Some pickup line or cool automobile or cellulite cream that will enable you to attract a bigger &#8220;hottie&#8221; than you really deserve.  This is the notion that the entire advertising industry is built on.  </p>
<p>Ironically, at the end of the day women may actually have it slightly easier.  Rather than telling us how to exploit the simplistic minds of beautiful men, our &#8220;commodity&#8221; messages tell us what&#8217;s wrong with ourselves.  We&#8217;re barraged with the notion that men may not find us attractive if we have wrinkles or wide bottoms, and that we&#8217;re on the downhill side of life after age 30.  While those messages are certainly degrading and unfair, in the end they may actually force us to become a bit more focused and realistic in our expectations.  </p>
<p>Men, on the other hand, receive the exact opposite message.  The world is full of con artists peddling the notion that any man can have his choice of the world&#8217;s most perfect women, as long as he has the right &#8220;abracadabra.&#8221;  So why settle?  &#8220;Live it up,&#8221; say the hucksters, &#8220;sow your oats.  Once you perfect your &#8216;line,&#8217; you&#8217;ll have a whole stable of flawless women. You have all the time in the world.  Look at Jack Nicholson and Mick Jagger and Hugh Hefner.&#8221;  </p>
<p>The result is a large pool of lonely &#8220;average&#8221; people (of both sexes) who find themselves incapable of being physically attracted to other &#8220;average&#8221; people.  I&#8217;m not sure I agree that the majority of them see the opposite sex as simply a commodity.  The media may present it in that light, but that&#8217;s largely because the media is in the business of selling commodities.  I think most of us want to find a deep and lasting relationship&#8230;. with someone who is ridiculously gorgeous.  This is because &#8220;ridiculously gorgeous&#8221; has become our society&#8217;s baseline standard for physical attractiveness.  </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t presume to pontificate about superficiality, because I myself have been guilty of the same mentality.  But I do think it&#8217;s critical to ask how we, on a personal level, can step back from this self-destructive approach to sexuality, in the face of so many societal messages that reinforce the contrary.  The alternative is a world where the fast majority of us will find it imposssible to start and maintain healthy and satisfying relationships.  </p>
<p>Ideas?</p>
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		<title>By: Luke</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1295</link>
		<dc:creator>Luke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jun 2006 03:00:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1295</guid>
		<description>tekanji: thank you :)

calfaile: I vaguely remember some news piece saying the guy himself didnt "follow the game" anymore and while i do think the ending certainly is a less disturbing and realistic point..i think the damage has already been done because while it may have a better ending, the glamour is already there from pages 1-99 excluding #100. my concern is that I see this the same way films like Scarface, goodfellas, the godfather are received in popular culture. in every single story, their lifestyles are immediately envy inducing...but it's all smoke and mirrors. it all leads to crap and suffering. but the message people walk away with, what they choose to mimic is not always the moral...it's the fantasy image that is so seductive. Scarface, for example, has been imitated in hiphop culture for years and even though many artists realize that things end very, very poorly for Tony...the message they carry is one of lavish lifestyles, not taking no for an answer, respect through blood money, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tekanji: thank you <img src='http://blog.shrub.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>calfaile: I vaguely remember some news piece saying the guy himself didnt &#8220;follow the game&#8221; anymore and while i do think the ending certainly is a less disturbing and realistic point..i think the damage has already been done because while it may have a better ending, the glamour is already there from pages 1-99 excluding #100. my concern is that I see this the same way films like Scarface, goodfellas, the godfather are received in popular culture. in every single story, their lifestyles are immediately envy inducing&#8230;but it&#8217;s all smoke and mirrors. it all leads to crap and suffering. but the message people walk away with, what they choose to mimic is not always the moral&#8230;it&#8217;s the fantasy image that is so seductive. Scarface, for example, has been imitated in hiphop culture for years and even though many artists realize that things end very, very poorly for Tony&#8230;the message they carry is one of lavish lifestyles, not taking no for an answer, respect through blood money, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: calfaile</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1288</link>
		<dc:creator>calfaile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jun 2006 19:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1288</guid>
		<description>Just a quick note:

As someone who has actually read "the game",  let me say that it's not what you think.  First of all, it's not a manual, it's a story.  Surprisingly it's a story about the ultimate mysogyny and stupidity of the pick-up world.  Second of all, the author (who was apparently voted top pick up artist), eventually gives up the game in favour of a real relationship (where his extensive pick up experience gives him no help).

I think that it's a book that should be given to any guy who believes in those pick-up manuals.  Not a feminist book by any stretch (what do you expect from the guy who co-authored "how to make love like a porn star"), but not as mysogynistic as it initially appears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a quick note:</p>
<p>As someone who has actually read &#8220;the game&#8221;,  let me say that it&#8217;s not what you think.  First of all, it&#8217;s not a manual, it&#8217;s a story.  Surprisingly it&#8217;s a story about the ultimate mysogyny and stupidity of the pick-up world.  Second of all, the author (who was apparently voted top pick up artist), eventually gives up the game in favour of a real relationship (where his extensive pick up experience gives him no help).</p>
<p>I think that it&#8217;s a book that should be given to any guy who believes in those pick-up manuals.  Not a feminist book by any stretch (what do you expect from the guy who co-authored &#8220;how to make love like a porn star&#8221;), but not as mysogynistic as it initially appears.</p>
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		<title>By: tekanji</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1274</link>
		<dc:creator>tekanji</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jun 2006 14:13:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1274</guid>
		<description>Helluva introductory post. There's more I could say, but it's already past my bed time (I was a bad person and went to karaoke today instead of doing my homework...).

I know you were worried about taking too long writing this, but it was well worth the wait. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Helluva introductory post. There&#8217;s more I could say, but it&#8217;s already past my bed time (I was a bad person and went to karaoke today instead of doing my homework&#8230;).</p>
<p>I know you were worried about taking too long writing this, but it was well worth the wait. <img src='http://blog.shrub.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Darth Sidhe</title>
		<link>http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1273</link>
		<dc:creator>Darth Sidhe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jun 2006 14:09:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.shrub.com/archives/luke/2006-06-12_293#comment-1273</guid>
		<description>I recently Googled for sex etiquette, and it seemed to me that the advice geared specifically toward men all had varying degrees of "well, we know you don't like actually doing things for &lt;i&gt;her&lt;/i&gt; pleasure, but if you make her feel good then you can go ahead and use her to get your rocks off, so suck up those 10 minutes of foreplay." I wonder how much articles written with that distasteful attitude in mind imprint that kind of selfish attitude on their readers.

I suppose it's a step above "oh, just don't pay attention to what she wants," but that's small comfort.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recently Googled for sex etiquette, and it seemed to me that the advice geared specifically toward men all had varying degrees of &#8220;well, we know you don&#8217;t like actually doing things for <i>her</i> pleasure, but if you make her feel good then you can go ahead and use her to get your rocks off, so suck up those 10 minutes of foreplay.&#8221; I wonder how much articles written with that distasteful attitude in mind imprint that kind of selfish attitude on their readers.</p>
<p>I suppose it&#8217;s a step above &#8220;oh, just don&#8217;t pay attention to what she wants,&#8221; but that&#8217;s small comfort.</p>
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